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Support for unlicensed users => Post here if you can't find your License Key => Topic started by: archiboy on December 08, 2010, 07:11:40 am

Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: archiboy on December 08, 2010, 07:11:40 am
Hi,

 

Wanted to raise this question about wheather there will be any performance boost for using Lumion3D in a SLI or Crossfire set up system?

If so, how much percentage increase in performance and in what aspect, e.g reduce output video time, better handling in larger scene etc? 

 

Please advice


Thanks Laugh
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Remko on December 08, 2010, 01:06:01 pm
SLI is something that's not supported by the software it's part of the driver and hardware. In our tests we found that all DX9 applications have little gain from SLI or Crossfire.  If you look at other applications you can see that the DX10 and DX11 versions have much better performance because of SLI than the DX9 version.

 

Lumion will perform faster with SLI or Crossfire but before you'll see huge improvements you will have to wait for a DX11 version of Lumion.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: archiboy on December 09, 2010, 01:10:04 pm
thank you, i shall hold my bullet for future upgrade then!
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Ferry on December 09, 2010, 01:23:53 pm
DX11 support might take a while since we will need to drop XP support for us to use it.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: archiboy on December 09, 2010, 10:30:19 pm
Thank you. I think I can wait for that because switching to SLI is expensive solution which the last thing in my shopping list.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Jacek Kwiatkowski on December 10, 2010, 09:54:33 am
Everyone see benefits of using dx 11- I just can't understand why do you still hold on to dx9 it will need to happen sonner or later. ( are u going to say the same story when dx 12 is going to be on the market  )How can you convinced custumers to use Lumion if their is no way to speed up the proces of rendering.

Crossfire - not in use

SLI - not in use.

Tesla GPU - not in use

x64 - not in use

dx 11 - not in use

If the product is based on GPU it should have a way to speed up stuff if you are to consider using  it for commercial projects.

I mean the overall idea is great. The speed is also fast compering to other methods of visualization, but  please......make quest3d support dx 11. Lumion is going to benefit from it at the 1 place.

 

Quest3d user  
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Goal043 on December 10, 2010, 10:37:54 am
A high-end program should really consider dropping a 10(!) year old OS, especially if it would give a boost to the newer technology.

 

Obvious?
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Remko on December 10, 2010, 10:52:09 am
Simple: Tesla/DirectCompute is very slow compared to the 3D pipeline so in graphics terms there's no use for this. Physics could be accelerated with PhysX but it only works on NVIDIA and physics is hardly a bottleneck.

We can easily render 15 million polygons (tested yesterday on a 480) at decent frame rates and this is well beyond the limit most people need. If we release the 64 bit version this number is even higher. More speed is always welcome but Crossfire is not some magical solution. It provides extra fill rate so at high resolution it has some benefits but in Lumion you can have an excellent preview if you turn the resolution a bit down.

 

Crossfire and SLI still work though! If you see this page you can see that DX9 scales but just not as good as DX11 titles. Some of the newer titles have perfect scaling while older games are faster but not exactly double speed at high resolutions. I think there should be some things we can do to enhance SLI/Crossfire framerates. http://www.benchmarkextreme.co.....is/P3.html

 

x64 will be available but we are testing it to make sure everything is fine. If they wouldn't have decided to drop XP with DirectX 10 then Quest3D and Lumion would use the latest version of DirectX now. Dropping XP, are you crazy? That's 47% of all computers!

 

So, if we can improve the SLI performance and have 64 bit what's the benefit of DX11? End users wil barely notice. Just pick up some games to try and find the differences between DX11 mode and DX9 mode. The differences are marginal.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Ferry on December 10, 2010, 11:01:18 am
Dropping XP really doesn't seem like an option for us. Just look at the number of people who have XP at the Lumion beta request page. Go complain with microsoft that they didn't release directx 10 and 11 for XP
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Goal043 on December 10, 2010, 02:15:11 pm
Maybe 47% of all computers on the globe have XP, that doesn't mean people who would use software like this (seriously).

Anyhow, you should know how many buyers of your software use what Os.

 

Best of both worlds would be multiple installs, or Directx versions to choose from.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Remko on December 10, 2010, 03:09:28 pm
Ok I agree those are not the figures for people who buy Lumion but still it's scary how many people still use XP! My guess is people got scared to upgrade because of Vista.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Jacek Kwiatkowski on December 10, 2010, 03:13:35 pm
Yes - I think the same - If the only reason Lumion uses dx9 is that most of the people use XP - maybe you could consider the rest. There are more advantages of using dx 11 then not using it. Do they sell notebooks with xp or they sell windows 7 home premium? Most of the computers are native

x64 it's a standard becouse it's nothing special. All the processores being sold on the market are x64.

I think that you are wrong this time. Maybe I could ask in another way - are there any plans, any timelines for the implementation of a dx 11 version. Or you want to stick with the dx9 solution and it's not going to happen in 2011.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Ferry on December 10, 2010, 03:21:56 pm
I will have to code it and I am not convinced we will need to do this in 2011. We can improve SLI performance also by adjusting our render pipeline more towards it. Further for Lumion right now I don't see dx11 having any feature that would justify us cutting out XP users. 

 

Of course times change and when XP is not used that much anymore we will update. But that might be directly to directx 12 or 13 depending if that will work on most systems at that time.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Jacek Kwiatkowski on December 10, 2010, 03:33:27 pm
I was using xp for a long time, I hated Vista becouse it just sucked - But Windows 7 is a totally diffrent story - it just works as it supposed to work
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Ferry on December 10, 2010, 03:37:07 pm
This whole issue has 2 big problems as far as I see. One is that XP didn't support dx10 and 11 which I think is just marketing decisions. The second is that Vista is horrible and people didn't upgrade as quickly as they would if windows 7 was the successor to XP.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Jacek Kwiatkowski on December 10, 2010, 03:43:06 pm
You said the same stuff when dx 10 showed up – nothing special – and then again  – dx 11 nothing special. We'll see dx 12 in the future- and you will say it again. Most of the people use XP….this is why we will stick to dx 9. And one more thing is that you can run dx 10 on windows xp and you can run dx 11 on Vista and you can run dx9, dx10, dx 11 on windows 7. I could ask another question – what would you do if Windows 8 would drop support for dx9 – as a marketing decison.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Remko on December 10, 2010, 05:23:38 pm
We simply look at the product and Lumion works fine with DX9. As a user for Lumion I would only see drawbacks in a DX11 version because it would mean you can't run it in XP anymore. What does DX11 have to offer to the user experience? Very little. Like I said, just look at what's currently available using DX11.

What we would do if windows 8 drops DX9? Simple: there won't be a Windows 8 version until enough people use Windows 8. It's the same deal with Apple. It would be awesome to have a Mac version but there are simply too few people who depend on a Mac. A company like Adobe can afford to create a version for every OS version but we can't (for now at least). It's a numbers game. There are three options: I) DX11 version b) Multi DX c)DX9 version. We pick c) because a) and b) generate less extra income than it would cost us to implement those solutions. So essentially we will make a loss on those options.

To be honest there are just a few people requesting DX11 and I'm sure there are even less who have good technical arguments why they absolutely need DX11. On the other side I can guarantee a mob will be in front of the office with pitchforks and torches when we cancel Windows XP support. It's a matter of time. We dropped support for Windows 98 when the time was right and it will be the same with Windows XP. Now if only Microsoft added WinXP support in DX10.... I hope this never happens again.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: m123456 on February 27, 2011, 04:58:05 am
Im just trying software now and must say i am impressed - finally a modelling program that can output quick renders in a few minutes...

But i was also disappointed that for a GPU based software no crossfire support.

 

 Regardless of the DX verison, there must be a way to utilise crossfire / SLI … i can play older games through DX9 and get full utilisation

and obvious performance benefit   ( usually 60% to 80% gains in DX9 )

 

My system is  i7 860 , 2 x HD 5850 in crossfire, 8GB memory but im finding the complexity of the model i am using is still dropping frame rate to 10-15fps , and the extra graphcial horespower i have sitting idle would come in handy . 

 

 I have confirmed with  MSI Afterburner.. one GPU sits in idle the whole time i use the software which is a shame.
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: gabrielefx on February 27, 2011, 10:42:23 am
Remko said:



 So, if we can improve the SLI performance and have 64 bit what's the benefit of DX11? End users wil barely notice. Just pick up some games to try and find the differences between DX11 mode and DX9 mode. The differences are marginal.




useless DirectX 11 code…

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....re=related

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....uavLefzDuQ

 

You can enable DX9 and D11 functions inside Lumion like all games do. Software and games are complex, I know. 3DS Max works on XP as well as on Vista and Windows 7, on Vista and Win 7 you can enable DX10 shaders.

Why don't you implement this feature?
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: m123456 on February 27, 2011, 03:58:32 pm
Also I notice the software runs in windowed mode ..

 

this- to my knowledge – running in windowed mode is not supported by crossfire or SLI. … need a full screen mode  [ not fullscreen window ]  …. 

 

so i would be suprised if anyone noticed marginal benefits in crossfirex or SLI as this is simply not supported by the hardware …  i have tried forcing crossfire with secondary app ( ATI crossfire xtension )  but as it runs in a – fullscreen –  window it simply doesnt work ..

 

It would be great if full screen option was availbale so people with multiple GPUs could maximise the benefits of the software. 

 

good link explaining how to get SLI / Crossfire working if not supported by Nvidia / ATI current driver set ... not Direct X related issue.

http://www.geeks3d.com/2010120.....lications/
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Aaron on February 27, 2011, 04:44:30 pm
Yeah, currently Lumion is just way too slow.

Please add support for Quad-SLI and 26.000 rendernodes.

If you could combine this with the new DX12 Render-before-I-Animate plugin we'd be getting somewhere.

Oh, on a personal note, I'd also like Birds to build nests and termites should eat the wooden floors of my 3D houses.

I'd appriciate a PM if you have it done somewhere tomorrow.

 

That tesselated water and terrain from the Nvidia techdemo does look cool though Wink
Title: Does Lumion3D support SLI?
Post by: Ferry on February 28, 2011, 08:48:01 am
You can already go to fullscreen. Just press CTRL+F11