Author Topic: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?  (Read 6491 times)

3dmk

    Reputation: 3
Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« on: November 26, 2014, 12:46:10 am »
November 26, 2014, 12:46:10 am
Hi All,

Just wondering if Lumion 5.0 is still using the old Speedtree 5.1 modeler to make custom trees??
Lumion would be way more customizable if you could update this to accept latter versions of speedtree or other software. Surely the use of speedtree 5.1 MUST be phased out at some stage as it is not even available anymore....and at $8000 it's a complete and utter joke. [They have obviously had a monopoly on the industry for far too long]
It seems most lumion users need to be able to add custom trees with ease but that is far from the case at the moment [I know you can import them as a mesh but I NEED them to behave as the trees in Lumion do, not just a static mesh.]
ANY info on this would be greatly appreciated.

thanks for your time
Jamie

Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2014, 09:47:21 am »
November 26, 2014, 09:47:21 am
Hi Jamie, please see my reply in your other thread.

(Only about 0.01% of our users would know how to make trees in SpeedTree and it would require a lot of work to upgrade to version 7, so I am not aware of any plans to upgrade to a newer/cheaper version of SpeedTree. I will let you know if that changes though)
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3dmk

    Reputation: 3
Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2014, 10:47:44 am »
November 26, 2014, 10:47:44 am
Hi Morten,

Thanks again for your time. [I have done enough posts today to say a double thanks for your time :-D]

I completely agree with you that only a tiny percent could make trees & plants for Lumion.
It's just that 99% of users would like more plants but the current speedtree system is not very receptive to the many third party tree/plant creators who could create the assets they could buy & use.
I also don't like the idea of paying $8000 dollars for speedtree and then have to negotiate with them as to how much money they will extract from me as a royalty from all my hard work creating trees. I completely disagree with that system and only businesses in a monopoly get away with it.
Their software is definitely not worth the price and it's just that they have a monopoly on the 3d Game engine industry/market that they charge and do what they want. I don't think a monopoly like this is in any ones interest, users or developers. I do feel however it will continue unless game/realtime archviz developers make some hard choices about change. The longer they wait the harder the change will become as people will expect more and more from 3D trees/plants in the future.

As again...this is just my two cents worth...please disregard if you find it of no value.

Cheers
Jamie

Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2014, 11:23:54 am »
November 26, 2014, 11:23:54 am
I totally get what you're saying.

However, from IDV's point of view, they are simply protecting their investment :)

At Act-3D we think it would be great if people could make their own trees for use in Lumion, but upgrading to SpeedTree 7 would primarily be a resource issue for our developers in terms of upgrading the SDK - plus our 3D modellers would have to upgrade all of our trees and plants to version 7. This would take a lot of time.

This is not to say that we categorically rule out an upgrade in the future, but at the moment, we and our users would not gain enough by upgrading since the resources that we would spend on upgrading would have to be re-allocated from other feature/content development.
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BABE™

    Reputation: 105
Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2014, 12:07:17 pm »
November 26, 2014, 12:07:17 pm
people will expect more and more from 3D trees/plants in the future.
As again...this is just my two cents worth...please disregard if you find it of no value.
Cheers
Jamie

hi Jamie
the 3d plants in pro5 , are almost vray looking , in my opinion .
plus they render out @ about 7 seconds !. ;)
.

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tildee

    Reputation: 15
Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2014, 01:43:49 pm »
November 26, 2014, 01:43:49 pm
BABE!
These are very nice! You're doing not only very good space-ships, but also beautiful nature-images -  Congratulations.

Sorry for hijacking your thread...

Tim M.

    Reputation: 2
Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2014, 01:49:45 pm »
November 26, 2014, 01:49:45 pm
Hijacking the thread as well....

Babe, are these all straight out of Lumion or are you using an post Photoshop effects?

Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2014, 02:35:22 pm »
November 26, 2014, 02:35:22 pm
BABE can make even a simple box look like it came from heaven :)
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3dmk

    Reputation: 3
Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2014, 07:41:37 pm »
November 26, 2014, 07:41:37 pm
I totally get what you're saying.

However, from IDV's point of view, they are simply protecting their investment :)

At Act-3D we think it would be great if people could make their own trees for use in Lumion, but upgrading to SpeedTree 7 would primarily be a resource issue for our developers in terms of upgrading the SDK - plus our 3D modellers would have to upgrade all of our trees and plants to version 7. This would take a lot of time.

This is not to say that we categorically rule out an upgrade in the future, but at the moment, we and our users would not gain enough by upgrading since the resources that we would spend on upgrading would have to be re-allocated from other feature/content development.

Thanks again for the extra info Morten ;) ....and I completely understand.
It's a pity that the trees/plants made in version 5 would have to be completely re-made in version 7??
 Seems like that would have annoyed a lot of people who created huge libraries in version 5.

Cheers
Jamie

Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2014, 08:08:13 pm »
November 26, 2014, 08:08:13 pm
It's a pity that the trees/plants made in version 5 would have to be completely re-made in version 7??

(Just to clarify: I said upgraded, not re-made. The best case scenario is that all v5.1 trees/plants could simply be loaded in SpeedTree Modeler 7 and re-compiled as .srt files without any other changes, but we don't know if that's the case or not)
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3dmk

    Reputation: 3
Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2014, 08:18:26 pm »
November 26, 2014, 08:18:26 pm
hi Jamie
the 3d plants in pro5 , are almost vray looking , im my opinon .
plus they render out @ about 7 seconds !. ;)
.

Thanks for the previews BABE
I do agree that the plants are looking nice in version 5. Although I would hesitate to say it's anywhere near Vray.
IMHO nothing really compares to ray-traced images, but I am still VERY impressed by what Lumion can produce in 7 seconds of render time. 
One thing I noticed with the Lumion tree/plants is that they are often too uniform in colour. It would be absolutely fantastic to see Lumion incorporate Vertex-Colours as many other realtime engines do.
Vertex Colours can be composited with with your bitmap/base colour to add lots of extra variation.
You can also use Vertex colours for Lighting and alpha channels as well. Do you know if speedtree can use Vertex Colours?????
Have a look here for more info regarding their use.
http://exlevel.com/forum/index.php?/topic/68-vertex-colours/
 I asked for this to be developed a couple of years ago and helped with testing the beta versions of this new feature in GrowFX Tree/plant modeler
It  made such a huge difference to the realism of the trees & plants I create. [see the last page for a render showing the difference with & without vertex colour.]

Fingers crossed that Vertex colours will be part of Lumion one day as it it quite common in most game engines :7

Cheers
Jamie

3dmk

    Reputation: 3
Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2014, 08:23:16 pm »
November 26, 2014, 08:23:16 pm
(Just to clarify: I said upgraded, not re-made. The best case scenario is that all v5.1 trees/plants could simply be loaded in SpeedTree Modeler 7 and re-compiled as .srt files without any other changes, but we don't know if that's the case or not)

Sorry i mis-read that.  :-[
I hope that it would be the easier option for...no one likes starting all over again :-D
Cheers


Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2014, 08:35:05 pm »
November 26, 2014, 08:35:05 pm
I hope that it would be the easier option for...no one likes starting all over again :-D

Indeed :)
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Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #13 on: November 26, 2014, 08:42:53 pm »
November 26, 2014, 08:42:53 pm
Your tree and fern models definitely looks better with a bit of colour variation.

Do you know if speedtree can use Vertex Colours?????
Unfortunately not (See this forum post).

If you select one or more trees/plants, and click on the Edit properties button you can however change the colour of all green-ish elements on the tree/plant to a hue of your choice.

It's of course not the same as using the vertex colour channel for colour variations, but at least it does give you the option of making identical trees look more varied and/or seasonal.
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BABE™

    Reputation: 105
Re: Version 5.0 - Is it Still using Speedtree 5.1?
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2014, 01:16:54 am »
November 27, 2014, 01:16:54 am
BABE!
These are very nice! You're doing not only very good space-ships, but also beautiful nature-images -  Congratulations.
Sorry for hijacking your thread...

Thanx Tildee x, it could look like LAND OF THE GIANTS  ;)



Hijacking the thread as well....
Babe, are these all straight out of Lumion or are you using an post Photoshop effects?


oh no theres no photoshop, in these renders
 as their so many post effects in lumion anyway.
whoever created the BAMBOO-MODELS ,did a goodjob  ;)


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