Author Topic: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)  (Read 13726 times)

Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #45 on: October 21, 2014, 01:46:13 pm »
October 21, 2014, 01:46:13 pm
I saw that Lumion 5 will support Relief Mapping (technique similar to Parallax Occlusion Mapping) for new materials interface.

Hi pz_zel, Lumion 5.0 uses a proprietary technique for the new materials.

Will this function  be based on heightmaps textures (like POM in CryEngine 3) for imported objects ?

No, heightmaps are not used for the new materials in Lumion 5.0.
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Zdenek Fajfrlik

    Reputation: 26
Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #46 on: October 22, 2014, 08:10:48 am »
October 22, 2014, 08:10:48 am
hello,
interesting preview!

can't wait to see, if the mass placement and movement functions also work on

- curved native terrain

- imported mesh-terrains (curved)

&

is there a detailed feature list somewhere?
thanx and regards
stan

Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #47 on: October 22, 2014, 09:32:04 am »
October 22, 2014, 09:32:04 am
can't wait to see, if the mass placement and movement functions also work on

- curved native terrain

- imported mesh-terrains (curved)
Hi stan, here's a couple of excerpt from other forum threads:

Mass Placement tool:
It's currently a rectangular plane from A to B (unless the rectangle penetrates the Lumion terrain - if so, the objects will conform to the contours of the Lumion terrain). Objects will not conform to the contours of an imported terrain.

Mass Move effect:
Regarding the Mass Move effect, you create a straight line from A to B, and define a width. The line will not conform to the terrain contours or to an imported terrain model - it's straight. Transport models as well as walking/running/swimming 3D people will automatically move inside this rectangle. Please note that the models will not avoid colliding with each other or any obstructions in their way. You can specify the speed of Transport models on a per-line basis, so that aircraft can be made to fly fast whereas cars are slower.

is there a detailed feature list somewhere?
The information that's been made available is on the 5.0 preview page and in the 'New in Lumion 5.0' table near the bottom of the product page.

The detailed release notes that include error fixes will be published on the 3rd November (because the developers are still working on Lumion 5.0 :)).
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IdeaImmagine

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Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #48 on: October 22, 2014, 10:36:30 am »
October 22, 2014, 10:36:30 am
Thank you Morten for your infos.
Can you please also explain what does "physically based rendering" mean?

Michael Betke

    Reputation: 35
Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #49 on: October 22, 2014, 11:42:19 am »
October 22, 2014, 11:42:19 am
This covers PBR really good: http://www.marmoset.co/toolbag/learn/pbr-theory

In short words: Better and more realistic (physically-based) materials.
Pure3d Visualizations Germany - digital essences
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IdeaImmagine

    Reputation: 4
Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #50 on: October 22, 2014, 12:07:53 pm »
October 22, 2014, 12:07:53 pm
From the first lines of the tutorial you linked:

"Physically-based rendering (PBR) is an exciting, if loosely defined, trend in real time rendering lately. The term is bandied about a lot, often generating confusion as to what exactly it means. The short answer is: “many things”, and “it depends”, which is rather unsatisfying (...)"

Again, curious to know how "physically based rendering" has been implemented in Lumion!

Zdenek Fajfrlik

    Reputation: 26
Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #51 on: October 22, 2014, 01:27:07 pm »
October 22, 2014, 01:27:07 pm
hi morten,
thanx for you kind report, so it's partly about x-mas 2015.......-:)

no, seriously, the output of lumion seems to improve even more then before, great! looking forward to update!

stan

RAD

    Reputation: 32
Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #52 on: October 22, 2014, 05:04:06 pm »
October 22, 2014, 05:04:06 pm
Hey Hey the Gangs all here!!!   :D

Thanks for that link Michael Betke.
Really Helpful indeed.
 :)

Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #53 on: October 23, 2014, 03:25:35 am »
October 23, 2014, 03:25:35 am
Hi IdeaImmagine

..Again, curious to know how "physically based rendering" has been implemented in Lumion!


Lumion 5.0 uses a proprietary technique for the new materials.

The implementation is to establish the fundamentals of PBR in Lumion.  So by necessity, it is not possible to provide an out-of-the-box complete solution straight away for all types of materials, nor for all variations in material types.  Once the foundation is laid, then more materials and types can be provided as needs determine.

Most materials are defined, at least the basics of, in your 3D modelling application.  You would continue to do that.  When the model is imported, textures applied to surfaces in the modelling application will get exported/imported for use in Lumion.  If there is a need to refine the look of the texture, for example, add depth to a brick texture, then you can add a normalmap for that texture.  If the material imported is just a base (color or texture), and you want to make use of the (extended) Library of Lumion materials, then you can do that, as in the past.

The interface for users to edit the materials has changed, but not significantly in that there's a whole new way (e.g. the Max Slate Editor).  You will be able to pick up and go with the new UI, it is reasonably familiar to you.  Neither is it complex.  The Lumion implementation of PBR itself is hidden in the background for you.  You will see textures and sliders to change properties, stuff you have been familiar with in the past.  Because Lumion is realtime, you get to see how the material will look in Build Mode or in Build With Effects as before. 

You are given a new, more direct way of accessing any surface, that the developers hope, will improve editing times and freedom of access.  It also provides more flexibility for new materials, as well as meet some feature requests from users.


Given the changes that PBR is compared to the current materials system and look produced, I would say that it will be best to complete v4 scenes and renders, and start new projects with v5.  This is not an absolute, just a guide in terms of ensuring users avoid unneeded time trying to replicate exactly how things looked in v4.  The time required to update materials to v5 may of course be worth it, and so some users will choose to move their scene to v5.

Some projects extend over Lumion versions, so it will require users to re-apply materials for v5.  The developers have matched all current material types, and tried to match as many common features between the old and new, so that models can be imported with materials, or for currently worked on models.  This has been done to ease the transition.  In other words, Lumion will read in a 4.x model, but you will 'most likely' have to re-apply, or change the property settings for your materials in v5.0.

As Morten mentions:
Quote
... 'most likely' because the developers are still working on it, so everything I say here is subject to change until Nov 3.


What may take a little getting used to, is the change in look.  Not for everything, but for some materials, overall for the scene, the way objects interact with light, and in some cases in subtle ways.  Looks that improve the realism/quality of the scene.

Hope this answers your question.
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IdeaImmagine

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Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #54 on: October 23, 2014, 09:56:46 am »
October 23, 2014, 09:56:46 am
If I understand well, this means that "physically based rendering" applies to new materials in Lumion 5.0.
Some other realtime-rendering softwares talks about it referring to lights too, but it is not so clear.

So thank you for your (long) explanation, Peterm! :)

Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #55 on: October 23, 2014, 10:33:31 am »
October 23, 2014, 10:33:31 am
Well, as I understand, the developers have also worked on the lighting (not lights) system for various aspects. 

Part of the implicit nature of PBR materials is the way the material reacts to light, so it's not just a change in things like handling textures, but in how the material then reacts to light to give it that final look.
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IdeaImmagine

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Re: Secrets are Revealed! Just Saying! :)
« Reply #56 on: October 23, 2014, 12:48:16 pm »
October 23, 2014, 12:48:16 pm
Thanks, Peterm! Your note about "lighting system" (rather than just "lights") is crucial.
It seems that the first important difference is between "biased" and "unbiased" rendering.

For example, Next Limit talks about "Just real world physics":
Maxwell Render features

Otoy talks about "Physically based / Spectral Light Transport":
Octane Render features